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Post by UrbanLegend on Apr 20, 2005 12:39:50 GMT -5
Would this technically make Ken Wanatanbe be Ubu?
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Post by ripper48 on Apr 20, 2005 13:54:05 GMT -5
Technically, yes, I suppose it would, but Ubu never really posed as Ra's for Ra's in the animated series...
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Post by TheShadow on Apr 20, 2005 19:35:06 GMT -5
Ubu posed as Ra's for a brief scene of the "Daughter of the Demon" story, the issue that introduced Ra's Al Ghul and Ubu.
For anybody who hasn't read it: Ra's sets up a false kidnapping of Talia and kidnaps Robin. He then meets up with Batman to "work together" in solving the mystery. Towards the end of the story, Batman, Ra's, and Ubu journey up a mountain in the Himalayas, where The Demon's Head hideout is (isn't it where Bruce gets trained by Ducard and Ra's in the script? ;D). They are soon attacked and Ra's is "wounded." Batman goes into the base and then reveals to all the guards that he knew the whole time that the kidnappins were all a charade set up by Ra's and then "The Demon's Head" walks in- a huge guy with a ceremonial mask. After Batman fights off a few guards, he rips off the ceremonial mask of "The Demon's Head"- revealing Ubu. Needless to say...Batman kicks his @$$ after that.
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Post by TheShadow on Apr 27, 2005 19:26:50 GMT -5
Do u guys think that this Ra's twist is gonna work with the fans who aren't in the know? Seriously, Liam Neeson acts so Ra's-like in the trailer ("A Legend. Mr. Wayne."- God, I can't wait to hear him say "Detective" in a sequel) and looks more like the character. Ken Watanabe, while great, doesn't look at all like Ra's (as I've said before, have him keep those things on his chin, but let him grow out his hair and at least make him look like Ra's), although I'm glad that he does speak English in the film ("Gotham must be destroyed.")
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Post by ripper48 on Apr 29, 2005 7:46:49 GMT -5
Yeah, in the script he had no lines in English at all, so it is good to see him have some lines... And for people who haven't figured it out by spoiling themselves, I don't think they will know until they see it...mostly because they've already convinced themselves that they're having a "new take" on Ra's, and that's why he doesn't look like the Ra's we know.  |
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Post by youngbat on May 2, 2005 21:33:34 GMT -5
Not to change the subject, but I was on the French Begins website, and they have some awesome music, and sound effect which I don't hear in U.S. website. Now I can't find the URL to get back there.....
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FlaBat
Gotham Tourist
Posts: 46
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Post by FlaBat on May 6, 2005 22:08:20 GMT -5
How will the “twist” affect the packaging in regards to the action figures? If Ducard is Ra’s and Ra’s is Ubu will they change the names on the packaging after the film opens?
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Post by ripper48 on May 7, 2005 9:35:27 GMT -5
I'm guessing they won't...
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FlaBat
Gotham Tourist
Posts: 46
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Post by FlaBat on May 7, 2005 23:20:28 GMT -5
No, I don’t think they will either. I think it will look odd after the movie comes out that the figures had different names in the film.
I recall the Lost In Space figures where the Dr. Smith figure was boxed so you could not see it because it would give away the plot
Also Phantasm was packed with the head piece on so that it would not give away the plot in Mask Of The Phantasm either.
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Post by TheShadow on May 10, 2005 22:48:55 GMT -5
Okay, here's a thought...
Talia. Do you think she could've worked if they put her in the film?
I personally think that she wasn't necessary. I don't think Ra's's appearance in the films should be dependent on including Talia. Same goes for Batman and Robin and Joker and Harley Quinn.
I think the most obvious reason that she wasn't in this was because of the twist. I mean, who would they get for Talia if everybody's supposed to think that Ken Watanabe's her father, but it turns out to be Liam Neeson? Cast an Asian actress and it makes sense until Liam Neeson is revealed as Ra's. (hmmm...You could make assumptions on the mother. Still weird, though) Cast a Caucasian actress and that immediately tells the fanboys that something's up. And how would you do the twist anyways with Talia in this? Is she going to continually lie that Ken Watanabe's character is her father until toward the end? How would she integrate into the story? (I've heard an idea that her presence in the Himalayas during Bruce's training gives Bruce a motive for staying with the League of Shadows. Sounds like a good idea...but how would it work with the other details?)
I think it's a good question. If you HAD to include Talia into your second draft of Batman Begins and STILL have the twist, how would you do it?
For the record, I really like the premise of Rachel's character. I hope that Katie Holmes's performance and the script's characterization give us a great character and a great addition to the Batmythos.
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Post by ripper48 on May 11, 2005 10:09:17 GMT -5
If I had to have Talia in there (and I agree, like Dent in BB, she isn't required...though obviously, Dent is an important character, and we will see him, thankfully, in BB2), I'd have her show up in a cameo only towards the end.
ArkhamGuard from BoF had a good idea of how the "twist to the twist" may come about, and how it can include Talia. He suggested that we see the League of Shadows and a woman in a hood (Talia, duh) carry the body of Ra's to the Lazarus Pit and, well, give him life...And then Talia tells her father to "rise"...
I don't think that will happen, simply because I don't believe *this* will be the twist to the twist (I don't believe such an "out there" creation such as the Lazarus Pit will be used), and I don't think Talia is necessary, and I don't think she'll be used...
In fact, I've got a feeling probably that Rachel will remain the interest throughout the trilogy...I'd love to say Catwoman will show up, but I don't think Goyer and Nolan will want to take the chance after that Crapwoman movie...
Plus, I don't see how she can be as influential as she was in Returns...and Nolan wouldn't want to make a Catwoman that is simply a rehash of the old one, and he wouldn't want to make a worse Catwoman...I simply think the best adaptation possible of Catwoman probably came about in Returns...at least in spirit and character, if not in origin.
Anyway...I don't think this would happen, but I think Arkham's idea of letting Talia have a cameo at the end of BB, and then letting her be a bigger character in the sequels is a good one, if they wanted to introduce Talia...but I don't think they want to do that...
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Post by TheShadow on May 11, 2005 19:12:34 GMT -5
That would make sense: introduce her in a cameo AFTER the twist is revealed (although that ending seems more like a fan fiction dream ending than what Nolan and Goyer would want to put in the movie)
The Lazarus Pit...do you guys think it'll be in the films? I don't think it's THAT important to have it; you could easily make Ra's Al Ghul like the Joker in that no body is found and he always gets away mysteriously to come back alive another day.
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Milkman
Gotham Tourist
Fear the Knight
Posts: 30
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Post by Milkman on May 12, 2005 6:43:39 GMT -5
I bet Nolan and Goyer will leave Ra's open ended - all the articles and quotes I've read leads me to think they won't be killing off ANY of the villains......but you never know.....
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Post by ROBOTRON on May 12, 2005 7:34:36 GMT -5
I bet Nolan and Goyer will leave Ra's open ended - all the articles and quotes I've read leads me to think they won't be killing off ANY of the villains......but you never know..... Movie makers have a funny way of doing that...like you said you never know, but the odds say the villians return most of the time. |
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Post by Robin91939 on May 17, 2005 18:43:24 GMT -5
I think that it is awesome that Liam is Ra's. This is straight from Batman and Ra's' first confrentation.
In the Himilayas Batman and Ra's journeyed attop mountains as friend. Then the alliance was broken and Batman discovered that Ra's had kidnapped Robin. Batman was seperated from Ra's and Ubu, and Batman made it to a cave where Robin was. Once inside, a man in a demonic mask walked over to Batman. He had warriors by his side, and called himself Ra's Al Ghul...Batman called his bluff and revealed that it was Ubu and that Ra's was somewhere else, safe from danger.
PS, this is my first post. If your from the Hype! and frequenst the Batboards you probably know me. Also I'm on the Batsquad.net, so whats up guys? :up:
-R
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